Fiends vs. Seekers, Which one is better?

Hey guys,

I play CSM mainly and I'm looking towards some Slaanesh demons to go with my army. However, I'm not sure which ones to take.

In the left corner, we have a 170 point unit of 10 Seekers.
That's 50 WS4 I6 S3 Rending attacks on the charge, all with built-in offensive and defensive grenades.
They have 10 wounds at T3 with a 5+ save.
Seekers have cavalry movement, so 12" move, ignoring difficult but treating it as dangerous, and have a 7" average charge for 19" threat.

In the other corner, we have a 180 point of 6 Fiends.
That's 36 WS4 I5 S5 Rending attacks on the charge, no grenades of any kind but they have Hit and Run.
These guys have 12 wounds at T4 and a 5+ save.
Fiends have beast movement, so 12" move, ignoring all terrain and have 7" average charge for the same 19" threat range.

I'm not that great at math, but I'm pretty sure the variance of possible Rends can explode with a unit like the Seekers through the sheer # of attacks.
The Fiends, on the other hand, are guaranteed more wounds vs. MEQ (my main opponent) and are generally tougher to put down.

Which one would you guys take if you can only take one?

Thanks!

Short answer: Fiends.

Long answer: Fiends just win out becuase of their increased durability and consistency. Also they can climb ruins whilst Seekers can't due to being cavalry, and one Fiend can be upgraded to S6 to increase your chances of dealing with vehicles and monsters.

However, there is the potential there for Seekers to be better IF you can make it to the enemy intact, and the grenades are undeniably useful. Also, its worth pointing out that because you have to take an allied HQ, you could take a Herald of Slaanesh on Steed with Soporific Musk, giving the Seekers hit and run whilst she lives and potentially allowing the Seekers to fulfill the Fiends role quite effectively.

I still think the Fiends are better, but you may want to consider the Seekers from time to time.

Increased durability wins out for daemons. People have been complaining about bolters lately, and rightly so when they can now move and shoot and more 10 man tacticals are being seen than ever before.

And factor over watch. The wounds on 3's thing hurts greater than the wounds on 4's. Taking tons of dangerous terrain tests is bound to kill one or 2 on the way as well, and as John said, ruins and multi levels.

I, however, disagree with him on taking might. I do not believe might to be a useful upgrade on fiends. Your in it for the rends... One model wounding on 4's isn't going to be enough.

I was thinking about it and there is nothing stopping you from putting a herald on a mount in the unit of fiends and allocating them.

I did consider putting a Seeker Herald with the Fiends myself but it would probably limit them going up levels of ruins (which tend to get used a lot at my local club, GW and most tournaments I've been to).

Also, I don't consider unholy might an auto-include for Fiends (especially now you can't use it for wound allocation) but it has proved to be useful against a few units, especially Dreadnoughts.

Another thing about the Fiends is the models.

While I do like how the Fiends look, I just can't convince myself to dish out so much cash for unreliable finecast models. I checked a few places online for conversion ideas, and one came up with using Goblin Spider Riders as the body with a Daemonette upper torso. While that's all good and it's a pretty easy conversion, buying 2 Seeker boxes can just call it quits.

Have you tried 10x Seekers instead of 6x Fiends? My biggest problem with Fiends aside from the models is the fact that they lack grenades.

I guess I should just wait for the new CSM book to come out and hopefully, Daemons can drop in on Chaos Icons. That will surely make them much more useful.

Deviant: something to consider about IC and look out sir, the IC can't be on all angles at once. You can just shoot at the unit, From the side without the herald and make the wound allocation go back a few steps. If your herald is in cover, you could also focus fire the unit.

It is a good tactic, and useful, but not full proof, the seeker needs to be allocated a wound for it to work.

Aren't fiends beasts? they have the same threat as cavalry save they pass dangerous terrain tests.

Also consider the elite slot alternatives. If you want slaneesh I'd say fiends are the option. If you don't care then the new flamers would likely be a solid elite slot choice, leaving a FA slot for seekers.

They are cavalry, which is a completely separate unit type. Cavalry treat all difficult as dangerous instead, beasts just ignore difficult altogether

The conversion is very easy, as easy as building the seekers.

Seekers is a good option w. grenades but Fiends is stronger and more versatile in the longer run.

Latest gossip is that CSM icons can be used as long as a special caracter (forgot its name) is in the list.

I made up 12 with spider riders and the old dnet models it turned out great. Some one also pointed out these Confrontation Syhar Sighthounds. Look good and priced better.

Plenty of suggestions for alternative Fiends (and other Daemons) in THIS thread.