Hello guys,

just a question: do you find a unit of 7/8 fiends scary to face? Is it something you'd take? Are they game winners early on or too much points for what they do?

Yes or no and why, please :) !

Greetz, Bjorn.

Biggest I've personally fielded them is in units of 6. You can check out an example of that out HERE if you want an example.

They become quite expensive, but hit pretty hard, when taken in bigger units. At some point I'm definately fielding a Horde of them 'just because'..

Basically, you naturally can't just send them into the fray with wild abandon and expect them to do much against ranked up infantry blocks. That's like the general wisdom of 8th Ed I reckon.

They are a formidable flanker though. Send them into a flank of a unit already engaged to the front and you're [theorethically] gonna get a lot of CR of course.

They share Rare Allowance with Flamers which is just one of the reasons (I think) to why one rarely sees them in bigger units in games with 'normal' size.

Forum Member Pecu actually posted a BatRep from a Tournament very recently where he happened to face (amongst other things) a unit of 7 Fiends deployed 4 wide. You can check that out HERE. In that game they ended up doing exactly what they're not supposed to do - fighting a Horde of Bloodletters to the front, which just doesn't work.. haha

Yes I have tried It quite a lot actually. The thing Is we played with etc restrictions so my possabillities to buff them were small. To be honest 8 Doesn´t do much that 6 can´t do. They are scary fast, hit like a half ton of bricks and can´t be stomped. So mostly I used them to kill big things and grind down big units of low strength infantry. They offcourse works great as flankers to.

And how do you use them? Quickly on a flank, or as flankers? Wha are suitable targets for them?

To be honest I have used them against almost everything (not allways so smart) but typically turn one Is race them up a flank to set up flankcharges turn two hopefully charge In and maime and kill.
I have also used them against big and fast monster to lock them In combat until Papa Balesword comes running. It´s perhaps not optimal but It´s still a fast and scary unit.

On another note: what do you all personally prefer:

-10 flesh hounds
-6 fiends.

Points' wise the flesh hounds are a bit costlier, but apart from that?

Fiends, can´t be stomped and faster. Dogs hit harder so It´s not an easy choice. But the Stomp thing does It for me.

I usually run a unit of 6 fiends with great results. I deploy them on one of my flanks and usually let them fight small units/ monsters /cavalry ...

They don't always earn their points back but I almost never loose them. Just depends on what the other army consists off. I often send them to fight Skaven abomination , chaos knights etc as they can handle monsters and armor with ease (ton of attacks and -2). They are always worth taking in my opinion as they often tar pit or kill units that I want to "null". Late game I then use them for flank charges and hunting what's left.

Just watch out for T6 monsters as they can be a pain to kill.

Will be trying out a unit of 6 for the first time next Sat in Game 2 of a Death Match vs O&G. Will let you know how they do!

I would like to underline what tor said: "To be honest 8 Doesn´t do much that 6 can´t do." This is quite true, you rarely would need more than 6 as 8 in a single line would take so much space that not all of them get to fight and they lose some of their attacks and stomps if fighting in 2 ranks.

I had this boom going on once that I always fielded big block of 6 fiends on my army, but now I have started using flamers more. I normally used them to kill monsters and flank any big unit. Fiends become awesome when combined with some magical buffs. Some good spells that work well with Fiend/Slaanesh heavy lists would be Succour of Chaos from lore of Slaanesh, Mindrazor or withering from shadow, beasts signature and flaming swords from fire lore.

Speed of the fiends makes them quite unbelievable. You can combine them with Bloodletter horde with Charge banner for great effects. On first turn fiends run to the flank and letters move full speed ahead and on second turn they make devastating combination charge. Units that can withstand that are quite rare and having that strong punch on ones flank easily wins you whole flank and can even win a game.

Thx all!

Well, I'm having a tournament next week which only allows 1 identical rare choice. Normally I take 2 units of flamers. So now I'm looking for a faster unit on the flank to support.

I heard lots of good things about the fiends. What are the opinions in comparison to a unit of 10 flesh hounds?

In my opinion you should consider speed in this case. Fiends make MUCH better flankers and are also more resilient against ASF due to their high Initiative. Hounds are slightly more resilient when it comes to number of wounds, but they can also be stomped while fiends cannot and fiends usually have less attacks coming at them since they fight from flank most of the time. Fiends are better than hounds if they can stomp, but without them, hounds are better. Hounds also fight better agains Ws4 models due to their high Ws though fiends benefit bit more of the fear. Fiends also give superb debuff to opponents that flee while dogs are hard to kill with magic missiles.

Overall dogs are bit more straight forward. They can run towards enemy without caring about magic and anything while fiends have bit more finesse flanking units. My choice is usually fiends as I really prefer their speed (both M and I) to hounds brute force. Also I like the fact that I can use fiends to protect my greater daemon. In combat they are quite equal considering that you might face anything from unstompable WS4 units to easy Ws3T3 fodder.

I think I'd rather take 6, plus something else. I plan to (as in I have bought the models, but yet to play a game with) use 6 fiends in a unit, 3 Bloodcrushers and a solo fiend as my rare choices.

Have you thought about using solo fiends to hunt war machines and eagles etc on the battle field. A lot cheaper than using units like hounds, and probably just as effective.

dp

I rate hounds higher than crushers. Solocrushers are ok, but they are so expensive and easy to kill. Sad actually because I think that they and LoC are the best modells In our army. Good luck ranking up Fiends :)

deathphoenix: Solo fiends to hunt war machines is perhaps the most common use to them =)

Great. So in my 3rd ever post, I advised a guy with over 1500 posts about using a unit in it's most popular way.

.....................awesome. I'll go and sit in the corner now and keep my mouth shut. :(

No need to feel ashamed, nobody got upset or angry here and post count is just a number. Its what we write thats important, not the number =)

Fiends indeed work really well for warmachine hunting and killing small units. They can also be used as a speedbump against big deathstar hordes, meatshield to greater daemons against cannon balls and running debuff for enemies that you want to catch with some other unit. They are one of the most versatile units on our lists and they have lots of good uses and I would think not all of them has been even discovered yet. So lets keep on studying and finding them out.

In spite of this, I've never felt the inclination to run them solo. Apart from one game I have always used them in units of 3 and I feel that is the optimal size for them in all-comers lists, cheap enough to allow you to fit in some Flamers and not be wasted hunting chaff, but powerful enough to deal with small units of heavy cavalry, chariots, or units of up to 20-ish S3, T3 troops.

Once I've got a few more models, I would like to try out a unit of 6 though, I'm sure it could provide almost as much a threat as a Keeper to many units.

So I tried the brick of 6 fiends this past Saturday. I must say, they pack quite a punch! Turn 2 they charged a unit of 24 savage orcs. I lost the first round of combat for 3 reasons: 1) It ended up a tie and he had a musician so I lost by one. 2) For some f-ing stupid reason I was letting the 2nd rank of SOs attacks w/ 3 attacks instead of just 1 (and I was doing that all night even though I was doing it correctly for my daemonettes. And I had maybe a half a beer in me). :blink: 3) I completely forgot the stop attacks (I'm ALWAYS forgetting those!!! :angry: ) After the first round of combat I was down to only the front 3 (all unwounded). The next round, though, handily went to the fiends (mostly due to the fact that the SOs were only S3 now) and they defeated and then chased down the SOs and managed to put a lot of pressure on from my opponent's back field.

All in all, I think they did really well considering I was giving my opponent an extra 12 attacks a turn (WTF!?!?!?). Even against a medium sized unit of T4 combat troops and with no support. Against other things ... well, I don't think they'd do well solo against a dedicated combat horde or any medium sized elite combat unit (DE Black Guard, WoC Chosen, elite Dwarf infantry, etc.). I will definitely try them out again.

the trick is to use that sexy M10 to pick a target that you can just lawnmower with a bucketload of S4 AP I6 attacks. i have to say though, i'm continually surprised by the things i can charge them into and watch them come out on top. i'm considering bumping the unit up to 7-8.

I think I would have been fine if I wasn't giving away 12 extra S4 attacks and forgetting the stomps! <_< That's all on me for being a moron. I think things would have been a LOT different then. They actually did really well. I had originally thought about putting them in as 2 units of 3 but I'm glad I did the brick of 6. I won't use them in game 3 (want to test out some other ideas) but the next Death Match challenge I give out, I for sure will use the unit of 6 again to see what they can accomplish vs other armies.

I think they also seem to have a bit of a psychological effect on people. You see a big block of extremely fast MB and your opponent knows he or she is going to HAVE to commit resources to them (magic, shooting, redirectors, etc.) which leaves your other stuff unmolested. Granted in smaller games like I play they take up as many points or more as my infantry combat units but they are definitely a force to be reckoned with! Like I said, I will definitely use them again! :rock:

Yeah Legion you were basically playing them Fiends according to the 7th Ed ruleset (no support, no stomp) ... talk about comping yourself. ;)

I've always acknowledged the merits of larger blocks of fiends by 2 out of 3 times I've used them I've managed to pull some really crap moves with them..
Like.. Don't send them into the front of a Horde of 40 Bloodletters.. Stuff like that. It should be noted I was trying to assassinate Characters of course, but it was still a pretty dumn idea.

Unlike you Legion my group is prone to play rather biggish games, at least during summer, so one of these days I'll post a batrep featuring a damn horde of Fiends. For no good reason. I mean.. it's not like it's good or anything.. More like something to have a laugh about.

I'm still undecided on whether I will run 6 or run 4+1+1. :wacko:

Gah!! I just wish my stuff would arrive so I can get it assembled. I mean, come on postal service!! I have to play with puny mortals of chaos this weekend!!!!! Where are my Daemons!!

breathe out......slowly and calmly

Apologies for the outburst. I'll go back to my corner now..........

hello again all,

so I took 6 fiends last tournament, and I must say I was pleased by the way they performed. Their speed and I makes them awesome indeed if you choose your targets right. And if you have 2 blocks of BL alongside them, it makes it that much easier.6 were indeed enough, 8 would have done the same, but for a 110 pts more.

Next tournament, I'll turn to my 2 times 6 flamers again, but I'm seriously considering the 2 times 1 fiend too. And that all fits into the rare allotment!

Sadly (as was recently brought to my attention) 4+1+1 doesn't work because of the 0-2 cap on rare choices.

Oh yeah. I always forget about that. I'll have to try that in my first 3K game instead.
Thanks for the reminder. :)

Don't think about it as comping, more like ... "challenging" myself. Or, in actual truth, just being reckless and stupid! :P Think of it more of a test drive: "Let's see what these things can do! Woo-ha!"

We generally play smaller games because we usually end up playing during the week and/or we end up looking up rules a lot since we only play once/month or less. Once this Death Match is up, I'll have to get one of the other guys wrangled into one! :evil:

More games is more gooder! B)

They are actually pretty good at killing monsters to, wounding on 6s Is compensated by sh*tloads of attacks, I have never understood large units of Juggers (besides being cool) the biggest problem with large units of fiends Is ranking up them.