Please, Please help!!!!, Disease outbreak

I am having a huge disease outbreak amongst my fish. I have around 90 imported HM and HMPKs. We have had these fish for 1.5-3 months. We moved about 2.5 weeks ago to a new house. At the same time I got a new shipment of IALs from someone I have purchased them from before. I have lost 5 fish in the last 3 weeks.

The other changes that have occured are:
- some pellet feeding during the move (usually only feed live fruit flies, daphnia and walter worms)
- started using frozen blood worms to supplement their diet
- fruit flies had a mold outbreak, but we didn't feed those once we noticed the mold
- new plants from auction that were placed in their jars once their were quarantined
- new fish from auction as well


What hasn't changed:
- water quality
- water change frequency (they are in 1/2 gallons and changed every 2-3 days at most)
- heated fish room kept at a constant 80 F
- salt added to water

Symptoms that we have been having: (Not all symptoms are on the same fish)
- clamped fins
- fin rot
- fungal infection
- open sores
- lethargy
- emaciation even when eating
- IALs have white fuzz growing on it (just saw this on a whole leaf in the spawn tank, these may not have been stored properly????)


What we have been using to treat the fish:
- a very effective broad spectrum antibacterial and anti fungal (grapefruit seed extract)
- internal parasite treatment from jungle labs

Please help me figure out what is going on here!!!!!

Ok first question is this, what is the only thing common about all the sick and dead fish. The plants?
Maybe the IAl. were did these fish get sick, in there containers, after the plants. You have many things going wrong, I don't think its just one thing. Need a little more information. regarding usualge of the IAL, or the plants, are they in every jar? or just the sick ones. how much treatment are you giving, ??? and what , name that medicine..

The first thing I would do is take as many fish as possible and remove them from the jars, wash asn sterilize them all. Then put the fresh water back and use your dechlor, did you change that or start using prime, some folks fish have a reaction to prime.

OH when you replace those fish, no IAL, no Plants, nothing in the jar. rule out those items. if your fish im prove then put some IAL in one or two jars and see what happens, Also I didn't see that you treated the plants, just quarintined them. did you put potasium permaganate in the water. for disinfection and critter killing.

Edit: I would take water samples and test them for amonia, ph , kh/gh, as well as anything else you can test for. Any chance anyone added something to the fish?
were did U get the jars are they safe, do they leach chemicals.

I agree with Al... cleaned containers.. not just rinsed out.. no plants or IAL.. Do you have your water in a large container and treating it with dechlor? Is this new?

Are you sure about your water quality? Just cause you are in the same city doesn't mean the water quality cannot change. Clamped fins can be an indication of high ammonia levels and / or ich or velvet..

An all around chemical for finrot and will get internal Hex.. is nitrofurozone.. found in Furan 2 in the boxes by API..

Pam ..

It shouldn't be high ammonia levels since their water just got changed around 24 hours ago. I fill 2 7 1/2 gallon containers with water and let it age after treating it, adding salt, etc. I did move, but within 5 minute of my last place, and the water treatment plant is the same for this whole town. I prefilter the water using a very high quality 10 stage filter that removes 99.99% of chlorine, lead, VOCs, arsenic, heavy metals, formaldehyde, etc. I did treat the plants with a broad spectrum antimicrobial prior to putting in jars, so I am currently suspecting the IALs.


I did just sterilize jars, but I didn't notice the fuzz on the IAL until yesterday, and they all usually get a small piece in their jars.

What I am going to do:

Sterilize jars with no additions such as plants and IALs. Keep treating for fungal infection and on the emaciated fish, internal parasites. And see what happens.

I am still very open to any suggestions or comments! This is the first fish room outbreak I have ever had. Every time I turn around a new fish has symptoms! Ack!

#3) TB (teberculosis) Syptoms: pailing of the body and fins, clamped fins (not free and flowing) weight loss, open sores (Ulcers) pop eye, torn fins.... This is a VERY contagious disease, which is said MAY be transmitted to humans. It is caused be bacteria living in your aquarium, and most likely got there from your fish or new fish when added. a cramped or dirty environment makes this disease thrive. There is no treatment for this.
#4) Metal poisoning, (if you have ANy metal objects in the aquarium remove them now!!! also, a dechlorinizer for your water often helps remove excessive metals, and breaks chlorimine up.... Treatment, obviously remove decor which is not aquarium made or aquarium safe, which may contain metal.

#5) poor water quality, excessive ammonia burns and or high nitrates present in the water, leads to poor immune system and less coloration. Just like humans who are sick, fish also turn "pale" You can fix this problem by keeping the environment clean, and frequent partial water changes :) This also includes insectiside, cleaners and excessive medications in the water, this may lead to your fish becoming pale....you said you jsut moved, did you spray for bugs, or use heavy cleansers.

Did you say your fish is in a heated tank? I will tell you, that your Betta NEEDS a warm tank 75-80 degrees is fine :)

If you want to continue the IAL treatment I would boil it into a spa, that would kill any prolem bugs. I have a recepie here to make it yourself. it works its cheap, and it is disinfected.
Second find a new source for your IAL.

I am really worried about TB. How can it be irradicated (from the environment not the fish)? I use bare containers with some java moss for interest/ammonia cleaning/oxygenating of the water. Their whole room is heated to 80 degrees.

bleach everthing that comes in contact with the fish, for at least 15mins, then dechlor it and rinse it will. that will take care of containers, tanks, pretty much everything, but you have to leave it sit for a bit , and make sure its clean before using it again. Fish TB is not uncommon, especially from imported fish from Thailand. some say they all carry it, and something sets it off, however it don't jump tank to tank. only a shared water source would be an issue.

where are you located?

Colorado! I am trying to get a new IBC chapter started with Linda Olson.

Well hey, Linda is very knowledgeable about sick fish, what did she suggest?

I need to call her when she gets off of work, So I will let you know! Its great having such a wonderful resource and person in general only 15 minute away!

For sure, she is your best resource, sometimes you need someone with lots exp. to look at the fish, thats why I asked you where you were located. I still stand by reccomendations but with Linda being so close. Thats your best resource. Then again, you can ask us all the quesions you may have.We have a good bunch of experience breeders on here as well. ::welcome1

Yeah moves are basically like starting all over. Al and Pam have it pretty well covered. I had a huge die off shortly after getting going here again. I was ALWAYS nursing fish back to health. Most of the time to no avail. Here is what I did to get it under control.

1. Went and bought brand new food grade 1 quart deli containers.
2. Went to the hydroponics store and bought RO water for daily water changes.
3. Adjusted PH of RO water and added 2.5tbs kosher salt per five gallons
4. Dosed with half concentration Melafix and Pimafix twice a day. Three drops per quart container at each dosing.
5. Changed water every day before first dose.
6. Moved everything into a pantry closet with an air filter and maintained 80% humidity and 90 degree temperature.
7. Got some cultured filter sponges from a retailer friend with a well maintained biological filtration system.
8. Started an 18 gallon tub with biofilter and a sponge.
9. Washed all my tanks and equipment with half concentration water/hydrogen peroxide.

After about a month of constant water changes, and establishing tanks all over with clean cultured sponges. I finally got the mix just right for conditioning my tap water. It takes nearly twice as much dechlor here as the dosage on the bottle recommends for one thing. Get some test fish. Guppies or Platies. Or Veil Tail Bettas. To experiment on. Also make sure the dechlor you're using also takes care of heavy metals and ammonia. Test over and over again. Let the water sit for a day untouched and test it again. Sometimes ph and other factors fluctuate for whatever reason. You may have to treat it multiple times before it stabilizes. Keep track of your experiments and be sure to write down your mixes and results of tests. If you want you can use three separate treatments. Dechlor, heavy metal out, and ammonia block. I now use Jungle all in one. It works for my water at about a double dose.

I now use a clove of crushed garlic and 2-3tbs kosher salt to each five gallons of dechlorinated and ph adjusted water, and haven't lost a fish to disease since.

I really hope this helps you. I feel your pain. I lost all of my half moon males including a beautiful gold dragon white. Watched his fins fall off in front of my eyes. I only hope this can help you.

Best Wishes,

Jake